I am almost convinced that is not possible, but I am asking anyway…
I would like to toggle a plugin using a midi controller, which obviously cannot know the current state of the plugin.
My use case: after loading a snapshot I want to enable or disable, i.e. an overdrive pressing a pedal on a midi controller
Obviously I cannot rely on simply assigning it to a CC with 0 or 127 because the results would depend on the previous state of the plugin.
I am struggling to find a way using CV and/or midi plugins combo to implement a “just toggle” logic: every time a midi message is received toggle something (a CV signal or the value of some midi CC) fro 0 to 1 and viceversa.
I was hoping on the “midi note toggle” plugin, but if I understand correctly it will flood the system with notes?
I could also consider a DIY solution (I have now a PedalinoMini based controller which could be resourced for other projects). Having one mindi sending the initial state of the plugin to the controller via midi just after loading the snapshot could be a solution, but it seems overkill and would require a lot of extra stuff on the pedalboard
Sending 0/127 is not what I a looking for because, as an example, if my snapshot ha ovd to off, the first time I press the button a 0 is sent, which will keep the plugin to off.
Then I would need to press again, send a 127 and eventually turn it on
What I am looking for is a way to send always the same midi message (always 0, always 127 or whatever) and having some toggle logic on the mod
If you want to toggle the audio of the plugin with the same midi message, you can use Ztoggle4 , Cycle parameter on 1/2.
But…unfortunately the state is note saved with the snapshot.
The workaround is a switchbox (memorized in the snapshot) following Ztoggle4, not very elegant but it works…
scusa non puoi farti un’ulteriore snapshot e cambiarlo via midi?
perchè io con la MeloAudio command, carico la pedalboard con tutta la catena e poi programmo on/ff i pedali che mi interessano…un boost o il delay o un overdrive diverso per avere più saturazione…
you could take another snapshot and change it via midi…
because with the MeloAudio command, I load the pedalboard with the entire chain and then program the pedals that interest me on/off… a boost or delay or a different overdrive to have more saturation…
But I use a midi solutions “footswitch controller” which can be programmed to send custom midi messages. I use a momentary pedal, and have this toggle various things on or off. I hate switch plug-ins for live use because they are so sharp - and add glitches to my signal. But you can have a CV block get turned on by your midi - and that can go to more than one destination - such as two volume plug-ins - one that drops the volume from one path, and another that adds volume to some other path.
Let me try to explain what I would like to accomplish
My problem is that to turn on an effect you have to send a “on” value (127 midi, 10 CV, whatever) and to turn off you have to send it a “off” (normally 0 for both midi and CV)
So your controller, to actually toggle the state of the plugin, need to know its current state and send the converse value.
Different snapshots will have different initial state of the plugin, so you would need a controller configuration for each snapshot
What I am looking for is a way to send always the same midi value (e.g. 64) and have it toggle something inside the pedalboard.
I think the crux of what you are having trouble with is the ‘toggle’ part. The way I think of it the controller doesn’t need to know the current state of the plug-in, if the signal it sends ‘toggles’. That’s why I use the Midi solutions device - it lets me set a different on and off midi parameter so that it ‘toggles’.
But the Mod will allow you to toggle. Look at the various midi and CV plug-ins and you can probably do anything. I’ve certainly been able to solve most problems by learning those plug-ins. Unfortunately they are not always well documented, so trial and error is the way to go.
I’ve attached a screenshot of an example:
The midi Note Toggle plug-in will send note on, and keep it held until you trigger that note again. It will send the velocity while ‘on’ and send zero velocity when ‘off’.
The Midi To CV Mono will take that velocity and send it through as CV - but at this point it could be any velocity if you didn’t set your midi keyboard to a ‘set’ velocity.
no problem - This CV Logic plug-in is set to output full 10 or 0 CV based on ‘any’ velocity.
So that DS-1 is set to turn on or off based on CV coming from that Logic Operator. When I play a note on my keyboard it turns on. When I play that note again, it turns off.
You can use a filter to only respond to a particular note.
You can add a Midi CC to Note plug-in if your controller sends CC and not note.
There are a ton of ways to manipulate Midi and CC.
Now, the buttons on the Mod Duo X can be set to “toggle” and I do think a feature request would be that every plug-ins on/off switch should be able to be set to ‘toggle’ from any message. But you can get that result with the available plug-ins.
Now, if you want to add some subtle nuance to your pedalboards, you can take this concept further. I mentioned in my first post that I hate switches, because they can cause clicks when you suddenly turn something on or off. I often make ambient music, where that stuff becomes jarring. A guitar player might not notice or care.
What I do is use the Slew Rate Limiter. This basically allows you to scale CV. So when you turn something to 10, you can decide how long it takes to get to 10, same for zero. I don’t use the on/off switches on something like a distortion, I split the signal into a volume control, and have that controlled by my ‘slewed’ on/off. Basically the signal fades into the distortion, and fades out of the distortion. I rarely make sets of effects which follow a single signal path, I usually go the route of one dry signal, and may possible side paths. If a particular effect doesn’t have a ‘mix’ option, then you can also have CV close the volume to the ‘dry’ signal at the same rate it opens the signal to the effect.
This is the device.
It sends one message when the pedal is down - and another when up. That’s toggling right there. https://midisolutions.com/prodfsw.htm
I don’t know that I’ve ever used a midi controller that had prior knowledge of the state of what it was controlling. That’s not a thing I’ve ever seen, unless it was some proprietary device.
To keep things easy in a performance set up, I never use snapshots. I have everything I might use all in one pedalboard, all in one snapshot.
In that setup, it’s clear that whatever my pedal goes to, is off, until I click it on. It’s a momentary pedal, not a latch. So if it’s on and I want it off - a quick tap and it’s off. But that could only happen if I had some other button on the device also mapped to that same parameter. You can do that with CV, and sometimes I do if it makes the set up easier to use.
I assume if you switched snapshots - just always have your stuff turned off until you use the pedal. That might be easier to manage, but yeah, if that wasn’t the case, a quick tap and the off (normal) position of the momentary pedal would kick in and reset whatever it is to off.
For sure there is no ‘one’ right way to do things on the MOD, and so I often have to spend a lot of time experimenting to find the best way for me to do things, that won’t be complicated live. I usually have a set up with lots of options, then I trim that down to less options, or limit the range of parameters I can alter so that I’m always in a good place.
I would recommend playing around with the Midi and CV plug-ins until you find the best solution for you. If you have to use snapshots, then test the hell out of it. I don’t use them, so can’t say for sure what is best, just what I assume would be best for me, which is if a plug-in can be turned on with an external controller - I would have that always load up turned off.
