oh, sweet! 
…didn’t know this was in the roadmap!
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Thanks Jon
Like always I’m amazed at how fast you respond … not the answer I’d hope for but I do understand. I rather have you guys healthy and consolidating for future than venturing in all directions.
Keep up the great work!
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Thanks for understanding 
On this I would say that you are just lucky 
especially this week I’m taking a bit longer 
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Hi Jon,
Here I am again enquiring about when ModDevice will schedule the now really important improved clock sync. I just purchased the great LP3 looper but here again, not having beat perfect sync is soooo limiting! Even without tempo change, it only stays in sync as long as both clock finaly get out of beat. This is not just having a marginal impact. It does impact EVERY plugins like sequencers, arpegiator, Looper, requiring beat perfect clock to be usable in a normal musical context. May I ask to whom this could be escalated? It does not make sense to have all these plugins without beat perfect sync. On all my Guitar gear from Boss for instance, I does sync beat perfect without ever drifting away even with tempo changes. Please?
Txs,
Luc.
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LP3 has a “MIDI” sync mode, which bypasses the MIDI Clock handling from the host and does it by itself.
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Thanks for the comment. Not sure though how it responds to my question. The purpose of the question is to sync to an external host clock. Do you mean LP3 can sync on its own with an external clock without relying on ModDev clock?
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Yes that is correct.
The MOD “MIDI” sync mode is one implementation that converts MIDI time clock signals into data LV2 plugins can use. LP3 can be set to follow this clock if it is set to host sync mode.
But if you set LP3 to MIDI sync mode, it will bypass the MOD implementation and handle it directly bypassing the host.
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Just tried it… and it works well for now! Perfect sync even with tempo changes! Thanks for the hint. I’ll continue exploring further.
Now if this could be implemented at host level it would be even greater to get all those sequencers and arps in syn as well.
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Current MOD midi implementation does not ensure beat perfect sync hence this forum topic. Apparently the midi sync implemented by LP3 is way better. Not yet fully tested on my side but definitelly usable.
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Problem is, due to how MIDI works, it is just not possible to 100% sync it to a stable clock.
The low speed of MIDI messages means they have jitter, and filtering is needed in order to get things stable.
When plugins handle it themselves internally, they can compensate for it, even ignore parts of the MIDI clock and only deal with specific things they need for internal sync.
Issue comes with trying to map a jittered MIDI signal into a nice and clean, high-precision time information…
That is not to say things can’t be improved on MOD side, they surely can. There is a limit on how much we can push though.
MIDI2 makes the sync more precise, but very few devices are available that use it (needs time, as usual for all new things). MOD does not implement MIDI2 yet anyway.
On the other hand, Ableton Link sync should be a lot more precise. But older stuff does not support it.
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Does this also refer to an external clock? I often use an external clock from Eventide Timfactor or Cirklon. Mod Devices gets the MIDI clock from external and the corresponding plugins I then set to host sync, as I find everything runs well in sync.
As far as I know a stable clock needs a stable quartz. And an operating system always needs time to do calculations which can cause jitter. (As far as I know an Amiga ST was the only computer that had a stable MIDI).
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I disagree with this statement. I have numerous devices perfectly able to stay in perfect beat sync forever with simple old midi implementatin. It is as you said down to how its been implemented by Mod devices and acknowledged by Mod Devices as imperfect right now because focus was set to sync effects like delay or modulation that dont per se need beat perfect sync.
Synching musical parts like sequencers and arpegiators require clock phase to be locked and that is not implemented in Mod Device right now. It currently merely ensure clock rate is synched so that when host is set tp say 120bpm, Mod device follows. This inevitably leads to clock going out of phase due to clock inperfections.
In my studio, I use high end E-rm multiclock as master clock to sync all my gear including: PC with bitwig, Arturia polybrute, Deepmind 12, Keystep pro, Drumbrute, Tetra, Roland VG99 and SY1000, Yamaha Modx8 and all this stays in perfect sync for many hours without missing a beat even when tempo changes on the fly. All this with good old Midi 1.0
So this is not whether ModDevice should or not improve. It is about when.
And I do understand they need to do what is right for them to stay alive. And that might not include beat perfect clock sync for now. So i’m not pushing (well, just a bit). Just asking to implement it as soon as possible for them because a whole bunch of people like me using it in studio context and who believes in their product simply need it to use it as “expected”. So for now, I’m keeping it as a simple effect device on my mixer waiting to use it to its full potential.
Txs for your input. All midi devices have imperfect clock and yet, all my Midi gear stays in perfec sync (see my answer to FalkTx) It is a matter of keeping clock phase synched for all devices no matter how precise their clock is;
I understand what you mean quite well, but do note that there is a big difference from hardware implementation to software implementation.
Things that take precise timing (to / from hardware) are generally harder to do fully in software.
That is mostly what I meant on my previous post.
The main issue is the conversion between pulse signals (that can deviate a little bit from time to time, basically jitter) to a signal that plugins expect to be 100% precise without any deviation.
LV2 plugins talk in bars and beats, not in pulses.
When you have a DAW timeline for example, there is never a case where a plugin receives a beat 1% earlier or later than expected. Maybe when ramping up the tempo, but that is done on purpose, not by accident.
This is not me dismissing the issue, just trying to explain the situation.
There is certainly room for improvement on the current releases.
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I think it was rather an Atari ST. 
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Thanks for the clarification. I understand it can be trickky in software to ensure real time sync without missing a beat but it can be done and made quite reliable as witnessed by for instance most DAW accepting to work as clock slaves like Bitwig or stand alone Arturia synths all working in perfect beat sync even with a quite heavy load on the PC.
In the meantime I’ll contine using My DuoX more as an effect processor.
I really believe in this product. It has enormous potential. And I do hope ModDevice will be successfull and stay financially viable in the long term. Part of this however will depend on how reliably the device delivers on its promisse and not only with new functionality. Things that are there already must work reliably. And that is not the case yet.
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The case for bitwig is an interesting one, I was not aware it did MIDI (input) sync.
I have a feeling for who is the person responsible for that stability 
It is good to hear when we see others doing it, it proves it is indeed possible.
One alternative to having this done in the host is to have plugins doing it themselves.
Looperlative went into that direction, there are other plugins we have already that we could change to have a MIDI sync option (without relying on the host).
In my opinion, would be great to have the metronome sync via MIDI, it is a perfect candidate to investigate such issues.
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Just stumbled on this cause I was trying to sync a sequencer to external clock. This is extremly disapointing. totally agree with @luke101 that sequencers and arps are basically useless in almost any electronic music setup if they can’t be synced externally 
@falkTX; @gianfranco Hi.I know it might seem not high prio right now while you guys are consolidating after reboot, but having a strong midi sync would appeal to a lot of pro studio guys in need of rock solid beat perfect sync even with tempo variations. Like I said, all my midi pedals from Roland, my arturia keystep and drumbrute and even bitwig can do it. Without this beat perfect sync, all the midi stuff you guys have implemented is just a gymic. To any serious musician into midi studio work, not having this feature is a simple NO GO. I’ve backed your reboot project because I do believe in the concept, but big holes in the implementation like these are preventing you guys to venture into maintream. Again please provide a roadmap for a strong beat perfect midi sync at the core of Mod devices. Txs
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